November, 19 2010

HD = Herb Doctors

RP = Ray Peat

HD: Would you just describe endotoxin?

RP: Its chemical name is lipopolysaccharide. There are several kinds of bacteria that make similar things. But this combination of a starch-like molecule with some fatty acids attached to it and it's so widely distributed that all animals have a system for reacting to it and defending themselves against it. And it seems to be partly a bacterial defence against the bacteria's environment. So there's an evolved back and forth relationship between the animals and the bacteria. And it's a matter of things getting out of balance that causes the endotoxin to be a problem.

HD: Okay, so I hear of many foods that promote this production. Would you be able to list some specific foods that people should think about before they consume them, given that we are going to open up the negative effects of endotoxin.

RP: Mostly it seems to be things that are poorly digested that pass along with a lot of food value down into the intestine where bacteria thrive on them. Things like fruit are so quickly digested by most people. The liquid parts, minerals and sugars can be largely absorbed before you get down to the bacterial area of the intestine. And so the more indigestible the food is the more risky it is for supporting an overgrowth of bacteria. And if your digestion happens to be poor, then more foods will pass along and become bacteria food. Indigestible fibrous materials, types of starch that can't be broken down by animal or human enzymes, become good food for bacteria and many of these are being promoted for intestinal health to stimulate peristalsis and so on. About 30 years ago some Australian studies saw that people who ate a lot of oat-bran were increasing the risk for bowel cancer. Certain type of fibre cause such intense growth of bacteria that the bacteria produce many types of toxins, not just the fragment of the bacterial {code?} that's known as endotoxin, but they can produce modified proteins, modified fats and so on from undigested foods. So endotoxin is just one kind of universal toxin that everyone has some basic defences against it, while there are other types of toxins that are more specifically influenced by your diet.

HD: So when people say 'Oh, I can't have a normal bowel movement if I don't eat lots of fibre in my diet'?

RP: Well, there are some very safe fibres that come from plants that have their own defences against bacteria and fungi. Raw carrots, for example. If you've noticed that many vegetables will spoil in the refrigerator, while carrots still seem to be completely clean and unattacked by bacteria or moulds. That's because there are chemicals that are defensive for those plants. When we eat them, they remain like antibiotics all the way through our intestine, so they are very hard for bacteria to grow on.

HD: And in that way they also provide a good roughage that doesn't get broken down by bacteria?

RP: Yeah. And it can also bind some of the toxins produced by bacteria, so that rather than increasing the amount produced, it can actually bind it and carry it out, subtracting toxins. It's almost like the activated charcoal that's used for detoxifying ingested chemicals. Carrot's a natural way of doing that.

HD: And when people say 'Oh, if I eat a good green salad, then I have a wonderful bowel movement' is that because the bacteria are actually stimulating the peristalsis, because we don't have cellulose digesting enzymes and it's actually relying on the bacteria to ferment and digest the cellulose?

RP: Yeah, some people get terribly constipated when they eat raw vegetables. Other people, it's enough irritation to stimulate the intestine. Doctors for a long time have warned against using stimulant laxatives, but when they recommend eating vegetables, it's really primarily a stimulant action produced by irritating substances, either in the vegetable itself or produced by the bacterial growth. If you've ever left a head of lettuce in a closed container at room temperature, you'll know how quickly lettuce can decompose. Compared to a carrot, lettuce is very good bacterial food and so it can become very toxic, if you happen to catch the wrong bacteria.

HD: So the last couple of months we've spent time talking about the different types of sugars, the 'good' sugars versus the 'bad' sugars - I don't really like to use that 'good' and 'bad' description - but even describing, Dr Peat, the health benefits of an easily digested sugar, one that gets digested in the stomach and very high up in the intestinal tract, thereby not providing any food for bacteria further down, and these are mainly soft, ripe, juicy fruits and honey, and even white sugar is pretty rapidly absorbed.

RP: And the lactose in milk is another good sugar.

HD: And lactose in milk. And those are all things that human digestive tracts can absorb quickly and efficiently without having to rely on bacterial degradation.

RP: They also have a defensive effect against the products of the bacteria, so that once you are poisoned by the endotoxin, the sugars protect by decreasing the inflammation reaction to them.

HD: So if you eat starches for dinner tonight, then tonight before bed, some good sugars will help protect against some of the endotoxin that could be produced by the bacteria that are digesting the starches. So those are what we call the bad sugars and they come from the starches that are more resistant to digestion, and include the breads, pastas, cakes, cookies, flours, grains, beans, rice - those types of food products that don't get immediately digested in the stomach and then can be digested further on down by the bacteria.

RP: Another kind of defensive food is the saturated fats. These are, if you think of soap and its antibacterial effect, the saturated fats are mildly antiseptic and so if you eat butter with your potatoes, the starch is less likely to become toxic material for the bacteria, because the butter saturated fats will suppress bacterial growth.

HD: So that means mashed potatoes with lots of milk and butter... can protect against eating these starches that are a little more resistant to digestion. And cooking them well. If you cook your starches really, really well. Weren't you saying, Dr Peat, you boil your potatoes for 45 minutes to an hour?